tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8196630391794341478.post2084532607151477621..comments2024-03-27T06:28:06.962-05:00Comments on Homeward Bound: Can We Trust the Gospels? 3ChrisBhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04611311820554248004noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8196630391794341478.post-78773530955873014252009-06-22T10:04:24.310-05:002009-06-22T10:04:24.310-05:00Vinny, it's no surprise you don't think th...Vinny, it's no surprise you don't think the evidence is convincing. I'll say again: I don't think there could be any evidence that would convince you.ChrisBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04611311820554248004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8196630391794341478.post-78562135494520803922009-06-19T11:48:25.895-05:002009-06-19T11:48:25.895-05:00If you've got convincing evidence of hundreds ...If you've got convincing evidence of hundreds of people in different places and at different times interacting with a dead man after his death, I would love to see it. What you have is stories recorded decades after the fact whose authorship and sources cannot be verified. The single personal account you have is Paul’s and he describes nothing that rises above the level of hallucination.<br /><br />The suddenness of the followers becoming bold is also based on those stories recorded decades later and the willingness to face martyrdom is from traditions that can often be dated in centuries after the fact. <br /><br />As for thousands of people turning their lives upside down based on seemingly bizarre religious beliefs, we need look back no further than two centuries. The Mormon Church grew swiftly based on a single man’s claim that he read golden plates out of a hat with magic stones. Thousands of people risked persecution and made the arduous journey to Salt Lake City based on nothing more than fairy tales. The religious gullibility of the human species is indisputable fact.Vinnyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08955726889682177434noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8196630391794341478.post-17713554700770720672009-06-19T08:25:15.677-05:002009-06-19T08:25:15.677-05:00"it doesn't change the fact that for us, ..."it doesn't change the fact that for us, all historical facts are explained to satisfaction under the assumption that Christian mythology was invented, accepted, and propagated just as in the Greco-roman religions..."<br /><br />If you've got a convincing naturalistic explanation for hundreds of people in different places and at different times interacting with a dead man after his death, for his timid and fearful followers suddenly becoming bold even in the face of death, and thousands of Jews abandoning centuries old traditions and even their families to follow someone who was, according to those traditions, cursed by God and turned those traditions upside down, I'd love to hear it.<br /><br />To date the best I've seen is founded upon wishful thinking, bigotry, and undefended a priori assumptions of naturalism.<br /><br />"you are just as quick as I to dismiss the stories of miraculous feats performed by the Buddhas."<br /><br />Nope. I'm perfectly happy to examine the evidence. Got any? At all? Even a shred?ChrisBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04611311820554248004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8196630391794341478.post-44356181016294170112009-06-17T22:36:15.633-05:002009-06-17T22:36:15.633-05:00I think the basic argument from the other side is ...I think the basic argument from the other side is this: apologetics is a whole lot of rationalizing for the superiority of Christian thought over the countless other systems of religious belief which you and I both agree are flawed and fictionalized expressions of man's longing for some kind of significance beyond everyday life. <br /> And while you have come up with many reasons, variably convincing, for accepting Christian dogma specifically as true, it doesn't change the fact that for us, all historical facts are explained to satisfaction under the assumption that Christian mythology was invented, accepted, and propagated just as in the Greco-roman religions, Islam, and the numerous Hindu and Shinto sects. You maintain that your successful church is based on real people and events, but you are just as quick as I to dismiss the stories of miraculous feats performed by the Buddhas. <br />And of course there are apologists for other religions, the only ones I generally hear about are Muslim. And Christian apologists engage in debate with the Muslims, but can you really believe that debate is taking place when both sides enter the discussion with the unshakable conviction that their own side is right and the other is wrong? <br />Dogma stunts philosophy. To the best of anyone's knowledge, miracles exist only in stories. To be religious is to accept a handful of stories and reject all the others. The fact that Christianity is currently dominant in certain senses doesn't make it in principle different from other religions. Other religions have had as many believers and as much wealth. This church is one in a long cycle of institutions.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com